I never cease to be amazed at the types of things that people study when it comes to the AFL. I get all sorts of interesting questions tossed my direction, some of which I can answer, others I cannot.
Just yesterday I received an inquiry from a devoted reader living in Italy. As I am not familiar with the intricate details of most AFL uniforms, I offered to post his question to the board. We have some very knowledgeable Denver Broncos collectors who read Tales, as well as several former AFL players. Here is hoping that someone can help out…
Hi Todd,
In reading today’s post “What would you ask Lance Alworth,” one thing came to my mind as soon as I started thinking of a question. It’s not related to Lance’s career so I don’t know if it fits the purpose, but I think it’s interesting.
As you certainly know the Broncos changed their uniforms in 1962 switching from brown and mustard yellow to orange and blue. The helmet was orange with a horse logo. The first couple of regular season games the logo was dark, then they switched to a white one.
With the merchandising market having a boom in the 90s, a lot of reproductions started appearing on the internet showing a brown logo.
Then started a debate with a lot of eyewitnesses saying the dark logo was a brown horse (which doesn’t make much sense but still…) and a lot of other eyewitnesses saying the logo was in fact blue (which it makes a lot more sense).
Broncos’ VP of Corporate Communications Jim Saccomano tackled the topic in 2011 asking 3 reliable sources: Chuck Garrity, former Denver Post sports editor, Ronnie Bill, who was the Broncos assistant equipment manager in 1962 and Al King, publicity man for the Broncos in ’62.
Key part on Saccomano’s post: Ronnie Bill added that, “I was the one who put the decals on the helmets every week, and there was never any brown horse. Every week I had to touch up the helmets and get them ready for that week’s game. There was nothing brown in the 1962 uniform.”
Mystery solved? Maybe…
Gene Mingo, Frank Tripuka and Jerry Strum, among other former players said they were 100% sure the horse was brown… Saccomano didn’t interview them.
I’m an uniform maniac and I’d really like to have the mystery solved for good, so it would be interesting to ask former players (and you are in contact with a number of former AFL players as it seems) if they remember which color it was the dark horse decal.
What do you think? Are you interested in the matter?
Sorry for my sloppy English!
Take care and keep up the great work, Mako
So, does anyone have any thoughts on this? Goose Gonsoulin? Gene Mingo? Tom Jacobsen?
One thing that I will say… Saccomano states in his article that the Broncos debuted their new uniforms and dark horse logo helmet in a game against San Diego on September 7, 1962. That is not wholly correct. The photo above is from a preseason game between the Broncos and Chargers that was played on August 18, 1962. If you take a look at #54 for the Broncos, Wahoo McDaniel, you will see that he is wearing the dark horse logo nearly a full month before the release date offered by Saccomano.
However… What is even stranger is the next photo, which comes from the same preseason game of August 18, 1962. It appears that McDaniel again is the only player wearing a horse logo on his helmet. But if you look closely, this logo (which is on the other side of his head as the dark logo, appears to be white! Could it be that he wore one of each type of logo during the preseason as some sort of test? Or could it be that the flash from the camera just made one logo appear white? Who knows? Who can help?
Found many articles re: the Broncos helmets, and about as many disagreements as to ‘what was’ back in the day.
One example: http://forums.denverbrcom/showthread.php?192658-Broncos-History-Helmets
Ring of Fame wide receiver Lionel Taylor did not like to have a horse’s tail on his helmet, whether blue or white.
“I don’t know why I had such a phobia about that tail, but I just did”, Taylor said recently-and so every week Ronnie Bill would affix new logos to Taylor’s helmet, and every Sunday morning Lionel Taylor carefully peeled back the logos just enough to cut off the tails!”
– so if we had Taylor ‘freelancing’/changing his helmet to his specifications, perhaps other players did the same/could have. Maybe Wahoo McDaniel decided to sport a horse on his helmet when no one else did & no one noticed/cared (this in the days before the current pro football climate where ‘uniformity’ (pardon the pun) was not as sacrosanct; just a guess.
As to color, whether it was blue, brown or white, memories from more than half a decade ago are subject to becoming faded/suspect. The referenced example of Taylor’s provides possibility if not an definitive answer, the personalization of one’s own uniform (I can think of other examples in pro football & MLB where individual players modified their accoutrements variously, some of necessity.)
http://www.uni-watch.com/2011/04/27/what-color-was-the-1962-broncos-helmet-logo/
One Horse, Two Horse, Brown Horse, Blue Horse
By Paul Lukas, on April 27th, 2011
OUR STORY SO FAR … Everyone agrees that the 1962 Broncos wore a white mule donkey burrrro oh okay, it’s a horse on their helmets — except during the preseason and possibly the first game or two of the regular season, when they clearly wore a non-white decal. Most helmet-history sites (the Helmet Project, Helmetpix, the Broncos uni-history page, etc.) show or describe this non-white pony as being brown, but our own Richard “Ricko” Pearson, who unlike most of us was actually watching football games in 1962, has maintained for years — for decades — that it was actually blue.
The search for definitive visual evidence one way or the other has become one of Uni Watch’s great white whales. The problem, of course, is that the only photos of this helmet up until now have been black-and-white shots. Wouldn’t it be great if I could resolve this thorny issue by presenting a color photograph?
Yup. And maybe one day I will. But today is not that day.
What I do have today, however, is a newly discovered black-and-white wire shot that brings us a bit closer to the answer. Behold:
Reader Mark Peterson recently spotted that photo on eBay and sent it to me. As you can see in the vague caption, the new uniforms are described as being orange, blue, and white (no mention of brown), but although the helmet decal is mentioned, its color is not. It’s tantalizingly, maddeningly close. Or as Mark put it when he forward the photo to me, “Fuckity fuckity fuck fuck!”
A few days ago I showed the photo to Ricko and Phil. Phil responded first:
If the Bronco was brown, you’d think they’d mention that, right? Why mention the uniform colors and the helmet’s main color but then exclude the most important part — the color of the horsey — unless the horsey was blue [i.e., one of the colors they’d already mentioned]?
This is not the 100% proof Ricko is right, but it’s closer than anything we’ve seen so far.
I basically agree with that analysis, at least to the extent that the caption’s writer was rational, logical, etc. As a journalist, however, I can tell you that captions (and articles, and headlines…) are often written by people who are total goofballs.
Ricko, however, took the argument a step further: “As I’ve said many times, had the Broncos kept the brown [from this design], for any trumped-up reason, they’d have been laughed at, booed, and generally benn the brunt of some serious jokes [i.e., because that previous uni was such a league-wide laughingstock — PL]. That would have made the papers back then. Guarantee it.”
But here’s the thing: Most folks seem to agree that the reason the horse changed from colored (blue, brown, whatever) to white is that the colored decal didn’t provide enough contrast against the orange helmet and was therefore hard to discern. Phil takes up the argument from there:
If the helmets were indeed Texas orange and the pony was brown, it might have been difficult to make out [so it makes sense that they’d change it]. Not so if the horse was blue — they wouldn’t need to change it, or at least one wouldn’t think so. In fact, I’d argue that the white, which is what they changed to, would be less clear than the blue against an orange background.
I basically agree with that analysis too. Hmmmmm.
The tiebreaker in my mind is that it doesn’t make a whole lot of design sense to impose a brown helmet decal on a color scheme that’s otherwise dominated by blue and orange. So I’m leaning toward this.
But we aren’t quite there yet.
Coming soon: Exciting news about another Uni Watch white whale. Full details in a day or three.
Does ANYBODY remember the 1994 NFL Season that featured a lot of “Throwback” uniforms? I do and I must say that the Broncos blew it for authenticity. The team wore the 1962-1965 Helmets…with the single white strip running down the middle…BUT they wore the 1966 Jerseys…with blue on the sleeves replacing the 1962-1965 jerseys which featured some single stripes on the sleeves…mixing the 2 made me…a perfectionist…kinda upset! lol
It would be GREAT if some former players, equipment managers, & the like could end these mysteries (this one, the color of Oakland’s helmet stripe in 61 & 62, & if Houston’s derrick was outlined with red or not in 66) once and for all…..
Frank Tripuka said that the logo was brown. I would probably trust those players who played during that era.
I would tend to trust the equipment guy. “I was the one who put the decals on the helmets every week, and there was never any brown horse” seems convincing. But I’m really curious to know what former players and people who actually saw the 1962 Broncos in person (not through photos or films) remember.
One of my favorite sites, Uni Watch, examined the matter on several occasions. There’s an interesting theory here
http://www.uni-watch.com/2011/06/11/beating-a-dead-bronco-of-a-different-color/
In the word of Rick Pearson:
“What if the whole fiasco is because of chintzy decals? Looking at the color on that mini-helmet it isn’t at all difficult to imagine that a decal material could have been too thin…or that it too-quickly yellowed…and either or both would combine with orange “show through” from the helmet itself to alter the color of the horse. Having built enough model airplanes, etc., in the ‘50s and early ‘60s, I know some of those decals were pretty lousy. Sunshine especially yellowed them.
So, what if EVERYONE’s right? That it all depends on when they saw the helmet? At that initial press conference it could have been nice and blue. But, once it got a little sun on it, it began to change color. A bit of yellow combined with blue, of course, will head toward green. Add orange showing through from the helmet and you get a kind of brown-purple. No matter which the specific malfunction, either still can get us to purplish brown.”
Paul, The Raiders did not have a helmet stripe in 1961 (or 1960). A stripe was added in 1962 when the team actually played in Oakland for the first time (Frank Youell Field). A great mystery is who drew the original Raider logo.
This was a great read. 1962 was a good year for the Broncos. They sold out Bears Stadium for their big game against the Houston Oilers which Denver won and were competitive throughout the year.
Charles, I’m not disputing you at all, but,,, your’ comment adds to the debate…
On the 61-62 Oakland question (which I’ve asked about on other forums) I’ve gotten answers that state: 1961- no stripe, white stripe, or yellow (Iowa type)stripe. 1962- white stripe or yellow stripe. ONLY thing everyone agrees on is 1960 with no stripe. All of the “official” data bases don’t agree either and I’ve gotten different answers from people who swear they seen them (just like the Denver debate we’re posting on).
At least I’ve gotten down to only questioning 3 helmets (1966 Houston is the 3rd, is the derrick outlined in red or isn’t it? LOL) to make my display of the standings for the 10 year history of the AFL.
Paul, I can tell you without any doubts that the Raiders did not have a helmet stripe in 1961. I’ve seen photos from all the 1961 games.
Paul, Thank you for your response. I have several black and white action pictures of the 1961 Oakland Raiders. None of these pictures show a stripe on a Raider helmet. Of course it doesn’t matter much that the pictures are black and white to show a stripe. It DOES matter for 1962 when a stripe was added to the black helmet. And I’m in a pickle on that one as are most fans. Send a self-addressed envelope to me at 4424 51st St #11, San Diego, Ca. 92115 and I will send you photo copies of these pictures. I may be able to help you with your Houston Oiler question when the Oilers changed to silver helmets in 1966. Thanks Paul for being a good fan.
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